Lifeguard

Joe Bongiovanni is the ultimate lifeguard. He's done hundreds and hundreds of rescues. He's now in charge of the Asbury Park beach. He's been doing protecting people for almost six decades. 

In this episode, we talk about what kinds of people work as lifeguards, what do they think of the work, and what are some of the tough and fast decisions they have to make. What do they do when twenty people need rescuing? What do they do in the off season?

Find out here. 

Discussion Questions:

• What are some other jobs you think have been around for centuries in one form or another?
• What seasonal work experiences have you had?
• Does lifeguarding seem relaxing? What do you think is the best part of being a lifeguard?
•  What does it take to do a job for six decades?

Please send suggestions for future guests to projectlaborpodcast@gmail.com. 

Our instagram is @projectlabor. Leave a comment or question and we’ll be happy to answer.

Music by Brotheration Records

Project Labor is a 501c3 nonprofit organization incorporated in the state of New Jersey. All donations to Project Labor are tax deductible in accordance with the Internal Revenue Code. 

Help get the word out with a small donation here. Thank you.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_04 1:24

The lifeguard Joe Bon Giovanni is in charge of the most interesting beach on the East Coast, Asbury Park, New Jersey. A place he's protected for fifty-nine years. A permanent light sunburn coats his skin. His hands are dry, but his fingertips are pruned. He wears a yellow and red tank top and a matching hat that reads Asbury Park Lifeguard. His mustache is almost long enough to blow in the wind. Joe is what Hulk Hogan wished he looked like. I found him on the beach. Hop in, he said. And I got in his green Yamaha side by side to do the interview. I assumed we'd go to his trailer office, but like a true waterman, he chose the beach.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

So when I got to be the age of uh to lifeguard, um I took the test and I started lifeguarding. I actually made my first rescue uh several years before that. I was uh just barely uh under 14 years of age. I was graduating eighth grade that day. And we had our eighth grade uh graduation rehearsal, and my friend and I went down to the beach because we were going to graduate that night. There was no school the rest of the day. And we were just hanging around. I didn't know what a rip current was. We were just hanging around in the water, riding waves, talking, and a young kid went sailing by us, caught in a rip calling for help. So naturally we swam out and and we we grabbed the kid, and I didn't know enough to swim parallel to the beach at that time, so I'm trying to fight the current, trying to cross-chest the kid in, making no headway at all, and getting tired, and my friend said, Well, let me try. So I handed the kid off to him, and they both went under because he was not a real good swimmer.

SPEAKER_03 3:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:32

So I took the kid back and was doing that, and after about five minutes of that, somebody who was surfing nearby saw what was going on, came over and grabbed the kid, put him on a surfboard and brought him in. Oh wow. So it was it was a good feeling, you know, that I felt, you know, I I saved somebody's life that day. It was a very good feeling. And I I never, I always remembered that. And then like I said, so when I got of age lifeguard, that was just a natural thing for me to be. So all through college, and then I became a teacher. So I was able to do this for every summer after that.

SPEAKER_04 4:05

What did you teach? I taught Phys Ed. Okay, in the in this area?

SPEAKER_00 4:09

Yeah, at Neptune High School most of my career, yeah. And I I coached football, wrestling, and swimming over my career there. In the state of New Jersey, they just passed a resolution where they are um now designating lifeguards as first responders, all the you know, because of what we do, same as, you know, first aid responders and and and that type of thing, because i i and it they're true first responders in that sense because you know the first aid and fire departments get it get a phone call after the fact. We're here to make the rescue, and so we're right there if there's any um additional first aid that needs to be done.

SPEAKER_04 4:44

Yeah, you're the uh definitely the first one. The first, yeah, we're the first line.

SPEAKER_00 4:48

We're really the first line.

SPEAKER_04 4:49

To that end, do you think that lifeguard uh I know that the White House just invited a lifeguard to the White House from California after he did like a really brave rescue.

SPEAKER_00 4:58

He he had a tremendous rescue there. It was amazing in some real hazardous conditions, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:03

Yeah. Do you think that lifeguards get enough credit for what they do?

SPEAKER_00 5:07

No, no, not at all. Not at all. Um when you think about the number of people, like just pick New Jersey that go to the beach on a daily basis, you know, millions of people go and they're on the beach being protected by in many cases 16, 17, 18-year-old kids. Now again, they're usually supervised by older adults, but th that's what's there. They're trained and you and you how many rescue how many uh drownings do you have on beaches during bathing hours when there are lifeguards on duty during the summer? And then how many do you have after hours or on guarded beaches? Yeah. So pretty much, you know, 99.whatever percent are after hours or on unguarded beaches when the lifeguards are not around. So that's just uh like I said, if you want to do the math on that, um, you know, how much they actually do and how many lives they're actually saving just through prevention, not only through rescues, but just through preventions. And, you know, we keep a lot of statistics here, and one of them is um, you know, i i is personal contacts. How many times we, you know, whistle at somebody and call them over or call them in or move over, and then go over and talk to them and tell them w why they had to move over, explain to them that this rip there, explain them why it was dangerous for them to be where they were and that kind of thing. And we have tens of thousands of those in the course of the summertime. Yeah. So all all that, uh again, um our philosophy here is lifeguarding is probably 85% prevention. So, you know, we we don't want to make the rescue, we want to keep you safe so that that doesn't happen. But ocean conditions being what they are on some days, um, no matter what you do, we're gonna have rescues. Yeah. Last weekend we had very bad conditions on the ocean and and and we had dozens of rescues here. Even though we kept the people in close um and kept a watch on them. Again, they were they were moving people around, hurting them away from the rips and into safer areas. But like I said, it it still happens. So, you know, you we have to be ready for that. But um, like I said, the amount of of um tragedies that are prevented by the lifeguards is probably 20 or 30 times full what the rescues actually are. And again, there there are thousands and thousands of rescues.

SPEAKER_04 7:22

Wow. Yeah, those numbers are wild. It's good you keep track of the stats, you know, and uh we we do, we do.

SPEAKER_00 7:29

And again, uh I I know uh we we um send a report in a weekly report in to our city manager and he passed it on to the council. And uh a lot of the council people have sent me emails that they were amazed on exactly what lifeguards do during the course of the day. Like I said, they they record, you know, again, every time they have a lifeguard action, which is blowing your whistle or telling somebody to move in or move over or whatever it is, and again, you know, sometimes you'll you'll do that 40 or 50 times a day, times however many lifeguards you have on your beach. So, you know, you might have a thousand of those in a day. Um, you know, a lot of people think, well, it's just, you know, you sit on there and you watch the water and you know, you're looking at the pretty girls or the girls looking at the guys, whatever it is, they don't realize, you know, that they're watching, and and again, every second of the day they're doing something. Like I said, that watching is and uh it's probably the the hardest thing to learn. You know, a lot of good swimmers come here and and there's you know different rescue techniques that we teach, but I think the hardest thing is to get them to watch the water consistently, know where the rips are, know where the bad situations are, and like I said, prevent the tragedy before it even gets started here. So that that's that's a big part of lifeguarding in in my estimation.

SPEAKER_04 8:43

Uh what are what are some of the tools that you use? I know we're in this um quad type vehicle.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

Okay, well that that that gets us around, and and and if you notice, we have we have several of them, so and so we have we have a system that um when and we only have three or four lifeguards on benches at different times and people are on brakes, so there's different numbers during the course of the day. So if something happens by radio we contact an inch bench, oh you know, to let them know we're going in the water, stand by. Okay, it's it's it's it's worse than we expected, send somebody for help. So with the quad, somebody can get you know from one beach to the next in a matter of seconds. So now we have backup. Because if we have three lifeguards on a bench and someone someone is in trouble, the first one goes out with a rescue torp.

SPEAKER_04 9:29

This is that yellow or red oval-shaped flotation device you've probably seen before. It has some grips on it for the lifeguard and for the the people they're rescuing.

SPEAKER_00 9:39

You can have a rescue torpedo. They get out there and they can secure the victim and they can float on them. And if they're caught in a rip, it's very difficult. You're not going to cross-chest that person in or swim the person in. So the second person will go out with a rescue line. And then we have to have another person on the beach to pull all of those people in. So that's three people mess rescuing, you know, one person. So now who's on the bench watching the water or clearing the water, something happens. So when that happens, we have a call and we say, you know, send help. So in in certain states, they'll say, say one, send two, and the two the neighboring beaches will send one person, so that now we have backup and we have somebody there who's emptying the water out so that nobody else gets in trouble and watching the people that are in the water coming in. So there's always eyes on the water and the people are protected. If we have all our our resources concentrated on one victim, what about the other 200 people in the water? They're they're not being watched. So we have we have a system to do that. Um we have paddle boards here that we use, we we use in certain times for you know for surfing. We have rescue boats, some boats that we can use in certain.

SPEAKER_04 10:44

How far can one of those boats go out?

SPEAKER_00 10:46

Well the boats is is well, it's for as long as you can row them, you know. We have that. We also have a jet ski that we we don't use the jet ski all that much, but we do have a jet ski that we can use under in certain circumstances. Um, you know. But um, like I said, we it's it's mostly um lifeguard swimming with again with a rescue can and a rescue line or a paddle board. You know, we can get a couple of people on a paddleboard. Paddleboard can get you out there a little quicker, depending on the surf. Sometimes the surf is too big for even that that to get out because you have to wait for a slack and you know a swimmer can get out there um sometimes quicker than a board. Usually the board is quicker, but again, it depends on the conditions.

SPEAKER_03 11:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 11:27

So you you mentioned that you uh taught high school, right? And coached during the the 10-month or so school year, uh, and then this is like uh your summer job. Is what what do most people do for uh like the rest of the year?

SPEAKER_00 11:43

Well, we have we have we have an awful lot of students here, you know, they're high school or college students. We have a few people that are teachers, and some years we've had people who were different things, carpenters or they did things and they would put their job on hold to come back and and and and lifeguard. Yeah. Um, I had a guy that I work with for many years who said that if you do this more than four years, you're kind of hooked on it, and you kind of always come back to it. And a lot of guys will do that, and and and some of them will just come back and work the weekends. They'll have a a regular job, but they come back and work on weekends. We've had people who are state police, um, you know, doctors, lawyers, all kinds of things that did it when they were younger, and now they're in their career, but during the summer, they'll take their weekends or one or two days and and come. I I have a lot of a couple of guys here that are retired that just come back and and work a couple of days a week. They they did it for years, they had their careers, and now they're retired, they want to get back into it, so they just work a couple of days a week because you know they have family obligations, and so they they just want to work two or three days to keep their hand in it.

SPEAKER_04 12:50

Okay. What do you think about while you're working?

SPEAKER_00 12:53

Well, we w it's funny, on on the bench, you know, when when you're sitting, uh the the the conversations um over the years, it depends on who you're sitting with, but over the years I I was very fortunate. When I first started out, I worked with a lot of people that were older than me, some of them, you know, 20, 30 years older than me, you know, married with families. Um, some were teachers and some had uh other other careers that they did. So when when we sat there, a lot of time we would have various discussions, you know, politics, life in general, education, um, you know, w it was it was really interesting. And like some of these guys went on to become doctors and lawyers and different things. So you learn an awful lot from from people, you know, and and and you're meeting people from different areas. You know, we had people that that came in from Iowa, came in from other states that, you know, grew up here and moved away and then, you know, came back later on.

SPEAKER_04 13:47

How does it feel to be a lifeguard?

SPEAKER_00 13:50

It's it's it's very rewarding. It's you know, it it's again, you're you're you're being paid to be out in the sun on the beach, which is you know a a nice perk of the job. But again, it it's it's very rewarding to know that, you know, on on a weekend, 20,000 people come to the beach here, and uh my job is to make sure that they all go home safe. Yeah, wow. And after a after a long weekend like we had, where we where we probably had, you know, dozens of rescues, um, you know, I said it makes you feel good knowing that, you know, people came here, had a good time, and went home safely. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:20

So it's it's I said it's that's an interesting feeling to be working in a place where everyone is here to relax, but your job is to sort of not relax. Right.

SPEAKER_00 14:31

Right. And and again, uh I I've been doing this a long time and uh uh I've known I'm I made lifetime friendships here, not only with fellow life goers, but with people on the beach that I've known that that come here every summer whether they're paying. Sure. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 14:51

Can you meet me at the basement?

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Um, I'm in the middle of something. Can it wait about 15 minutes?

SPEAKER_02 14:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:04

Is the basement like a code word for something? No, no.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

We're we keep it's you know, we've got a shower room down there, break room, and that kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_04 15:13

It's hard to imagine a basement on the beach. Well, it's in one of the buildings here.

SPEAKER_00 15:17

We got a the local developer that was part of the redevelopment plan if they had to provide a space for us because we used to own the city used to own all these buildings. Yeah. So we had space in in the buildings, and then when redevelopment came in, they own the buildings now. So we said, well, we we still need space to operate the beaches. So they said, sure, they gave us the basement. So it works out great for us. Like I said, it's like a locker room, break room, you know, the refrigerator down there, coffee pot and stuff, so they they can sit down and eat the lunch, get out of the heat, get out of the sun for a while to relax on their break, and and you know, because um, you know, you know, believe it or not, sitting in that sun all day is is very tiring. Yeah. It it takes a lot out of you. You know, and again, you're you're you're concentrating on the water. It's it's like anything when you're you're concentrating for a long time, you know, whether you're working on a computer or whatever you're doing, yeah, it it makes you tired. So, you know, they need they need uh break time to get away from it. And again, on a day like we had last weekend, it you know, they they're they're you're you're tense. You're you replace sports? Yeah, yeah. Okay, well, when you when you come in and and you it used to be before it had safe surf reports on the weather channel and all that, yeah. You parked your car across the street and started walking across Ocean Avenue and all of a sudden you heard b-boom, you heard the waves crashing on the beach. That's the only way you knew there was a big surf. And and right away it was like game time. You know, you butterflies start coming, you know you're gonna have a busy day, you know. I mean, so you you you know, it the adrenaline would flow, you'd be it'd be like game time, you know. Yeah. Now with with the weather channel and and and and surf reports, I can tell a week ahead of time when we're gonna have bad water, you know. Oh, okay. And so you can prepare for it a little bit. You can say, hey, you know, um, Thursday's not gonna be good, make sure, you know, you come in on Thursday, everybody's ready to go, we're gonna have a busy day, get a good night's sleep before, because you're gonna earn your money today, you know.

SPEAKER_04 16:55

What can you paint a picture of one of your memorable successes that you've had on the job?

SPEAKER_00 17:01

Well, uh, I mean, you know, if you want to if you want to measure in rescues, you know, I mean, uh I I've had, you know, hundreds and hundreds of rescues over my career. Wow. And um, you know, a few of them stand out. A few of them we we've had what we call washouts, where you know, 25 people get caught in a rip go out. And and like I said, you know, we have a few of those that are that are that are memorable. And um when I talk, we have we have a rookie training academy, and pretty much seven or eight of the towns. We pool our resources and we have them, we meet over at the high school and with lectures and movies and and and in the pool there, and and then we do some training on the beach to get everybody ready. So we're pooling all our resources. So there's a lot of experience there. We talk about different things, and and what I talk to them about in their training is that um, you know, when when you finish this academy, it's the minimum basics. You've passed the minimum basics, okay? Now you've got to work on that. And what you've got to prepare for, if you do this long enough, you're gonna have that once-in-a-lifetime rescue where you're gonna have to call all of your knowledge and every bit of strength that you have, not only to make that rescue, but to keep yourself alive. Yeah. And like I said, I I've had a few of those in my career, and like I said, early in my career I had one of those where, you know, we were just going in and out, and and you know, we didn't have radios to communicate back then. And um it it it was it was really hairy. I said, I I I to be honest with you, I didn't know if I was gonna make it, never mind bring everybody in. And it worked out that we we did get everybody in, everybody came in safe, and it was I said it was it really felt the sound after that because uh you said it was it was like I said there was 25 or 30 people out there. We had three lifeguards on the bench. We did call for help and other people came down to help us out, but like I said, we it was it was a mass, mass rescue, and wow, you know, and again, and and I've had I've had several of those over my career, but like I said, that was because it was early in my career, it was one of the most memorable that we had. What happened was it was remember, it was it was the 5th of July, day after the 4th of July, we had a uh nor'easter rain, so it cut the beach out, and when it cuts the beach out, it moves the sand out, so it it was it was low water. So you walked in, it cuts out in the beginning, so there was a dip. You walked in and you walked in and the water was up to here. Oh you walked out and you were on a sandbar and you're only up to your waist. So then that's the way it was during the day. So as the tide started to come in, this thing this filled up, and what happens is all that water has to go someplace. So it finds a low spot on that sandbar and it starts going out, and it keeps eating the sandbar away until it finally makes a little channel and a w and a river there, and it's it's like flushing the toilet. All that water that's in the shore has to go and it goes out, and it and the people that are standing out there, okay, all of a sudden this here, now they're up to here, and that water is ripping out of there, and you can't walk against it, never mind swim against it. And that's what happened. We called it, you know, we the sandbar collapsed, and and and and it was it was just a man, everybody that was on that sandbar got sucked out. So I was on the bench and I saw a little kid, he was walking in, he stepped off the sandbar and he fell in the water and he was over his head. But it was only like just deep. So I jumped off the bench and I went in, I picked the kid up and I walked him in. I got in, and again, we had no rate at the time, and I hear three blasts of a whistle. I looked up, the guy was calling for help. And they were going in the water. I turned around and like I said, the whole bathing area was just going out. 25, 30 peepers going, you know, you're all screaming and yelling at us. Oh wow. So I didn't have any equipment with me because I you know he just was a pickup. They had taken all the torps and lines out there, so I was out there and I'm grabbing people and I'm cross-chesting them in. And I made three or four trips out there, and I was getting pretty tired now. And and I get out there, and and and this older guy that I was talking about before, he's got two girls and he's doing this, he's pushing them up, and he's going underwater and pushing up and going underwater. And I've got a girl in my arms, and I and I'm trying to cross-chest her, and right in between us, this guy's amazing. You know, and uh we looked at each other and we just, you know what? We we I'm sorry, we can we got our hands full of you, we don't know what we're gonna do. But there was a lifeguard that had about four or five people on one of these things and was way out. And one of the other guys had taken a line, a rescue line out. So we grabbed this guy and said, just grab onto that rope and hold on to it. Just hold on to it and you'll get pulled in. Yeah. So he did that.

SPEAKER_04 21:17

And um pulled on through the vehicle?

SPEAKER_00 21:19

No, no, the rope that was going out. He grabbed onto the rope, you know. And when so when he got out there, they they they pulled everybody in. He held on to the rope and it pulled him in. Okay. And um my my my friend and I, I did, I told the girl, I said, grab onto my shoulders, and I swam over to the bathing line over there, and I just pulled us in hand over hand. How do you get in? I was exhausted about it. Yeah, so I said that's one of the you know, the rescues that I'll always remember. 25 people like you know, and when when when the beach is crowded like that, you make a big rescue that everybody on the beach, you know. Yeah, you're up there and there's you know, 5,000 people applauding for you, you know.

SPEAKER_04 21:57

Because you got an audience, it's a job where you do have an audience.

SPEAKER_00 21:59

Well, you do, and I I tell the kids that I said you're sitting up there, so like being on stage, you're you're sitting six feet higher than everybody else. Yeah, everybody can see you, yeah, they can see what you're doing. Yeah, and I run on a hard southeast day when the wind's blowing, they can hear what you're saying. I was walking down the beach, it was a bunch of women used to sit behind a bench back in the corner. You know, there all the time, and I I knew I'm gonna say hello to them. I didn't know any of them. And one day I was walking by and the woman says, Hey Joe, how you doing? She knew my name. We started talking, she said, Yeah, she said, You're leaving for school soon. I said, How does she know where you're gonna do it? She knew where I was going to school, she knows I get back to the bench and I said, I don't know any of them. She said, Well, it's the Southeast Wind, your voice carries. So they're 25 yards away, but they're listening to everything we say. We're telling jokes and they're listening to the jokes and we're you know telling the story. So I I learned and I tell that to the kids. I said, So watch what you say on the bench, you know, because people are listening to you as well and watching you, you know. So you're you're up there, you know, talking on your cell phone, you think nobody can see you, they can see you. And it's a no no, you can't do that. Right. You're up there, and and I've had that case. People come up to me and say, you know, I'm sitting here at a lifeguard bench and they're using pretty foul language. They're just talking to each other and using the F word, and you know, I don't know. I said, the people sitting right behind you can hear every word you're saying. They got kids there, you know. You gotta watch what you say.

SPEAKER_04 23:16

At what point did you start to feel confident as a lifeguard?

SPEAKER_00 23:20

Uh I I I was always pretty confident in my abilities. I said, I I grew up in the water. I could swim real well. And like I said, I had some very good people to learn from. Just an example. It was my rookie year. I was on the bench and one of the older guys came over and he so he was going to test me. He says, How many people are in your water? I said, I don't have any idea. He says, What do you mean you don't know? How do you know somebody's not missing? I said, because I've been watching. I said, I'm not going to count the people and one leaves and one comes in. I said, I can't do that. I said, I'm watching the water. I said, if somebody was in trouble, I know it. But nobody has been in trouble. Everybody that went in came out and they're all safe. So, you know, like I said, because I I was confident that I'd do that. If if I had been, you know, half asleep or staring at my toes or not knowing what's going on, I couldn't have answered it that way. But I knew that I, you know, it was just ingrained in me that you've got to watch the water. Yeah. And like I said, that's the hardest thing for the learner to concentrate and watch that water all the time. And and and some days it it gets very difficult on days when it's real calm and nothing going on, it gets kind of boring. So you've got to train yourself. I I I keep keep my eyes on the water, you know, and and stay awake and stay alert, you know, that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_04 24:43

I asked Joe to paint a picture of a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 24:46

We had a situation a few years ago where it was after the season and uh there were tropical storms going by, so we had enormous surf here. And we only had a skeleton crew on, and basically we're just keeping people out of the water. It was the middle of September, keeping people out of the water. It's aggravating because you you tell them and and they sneak back in and you got to tell them again. You know, you don't realize that we're doing this for your own good. Yeah. You know, we don't have enough people here to really guard it, so we can't unless you go in the water. And it's a nice hot day, and I understand that, and I understand there are a lot of people that could probably handle the water, but we have to go with the lowest common and denominator. So if I let you go in, I have to let him go in, because I can't say you, you, you, and you can't. So it was down there where that L jetty is in front of the building there. There's a jetty that goes across in the front. We get a call that a lady just ran and dove into the water and got sucked right in front of that jetty. Now there's eight, ten-foot waves crashing on that jetty. She's floating around in the water down there, and I don't know how we're gonna rescue this woman because I wasn't gonna send anybody, because if you get caught between the one of those and get slammed into the rocks, you're gonna get hurt. So I'm I'm crawling along the jetty because it was wet and it was slippery, and I'm trying to figure out how are we gonna get this lady. And one guy says, I'm gonna jump in over there and swim around. I said, No, you're not. You're not getting out in front of that jetty because it's just too dangerous. But I'm not gonna let this lady drown. So I'm thinking about what I'm gonna do, and I'm saying, maybe if I can wait for a slap, I can get in the water and pull her way out and then swim her around, you know. And all of a sudden a wave came up and picked her up and set her down on the jetty in a rock like a feather. And a guy was standing alongside a jetty, he tried to help her and slipped on a jetty and cut his knee. She came away without a scratch. This guy cut his knee trying to help her, and like I said, i uh it was like somebody from above picked her up and set her on that jetty because she she should have been crushed by a wave against that jetty. I mean, that that's how that's how dangerous it was that day. I had someone said I I wouldn't let anybody go in the water there. That's how bad it was. I don't know where that came from, but yeah, she got away without a scratch.

SPEAKER_04 26:50

What do you think about the uh spiritual side of I know there's a lot of athleticism, it's it's uh mind and body, but what do you think about the spiritual side of of the water and nature and and coming here?

SPEAKER_00 27:04

Well, again, it it it it's like I said, it you you are you're out, you're out in in in in the elements eight, nine hours a day. So you get used to reading the clouds, reading the sky, you know, I can tell back there when it's raining, I can tell when you know where you know storms are coming. Um again, you you can look at the ocean, you can tell, you know, okay, it it it's gonna be bad at low water, or you know, we're gonna have, you know, we can you can tell you can tell different things. So you get to communicate with nature a lot and you get to learn a lot of that stuff. And again, about being out in the sun, hydrating yourself and just being able to take care of yourself on in a beach environment. It's just it's uh it it it I said it it it it's kind of like you know, survival mode. You get into survival mode, you learn to do what you have to do. And on a on a day when it's a west wind and it's 98 degrees and the humidity is 90 percent, and like I said, you the sand gets to be a hundred degrees. You can't even walk on it without burning your feet. So it it again, all that enters into you know your your concentration while you're sitting up there tr trying to stay cool, trying to stay watching the water, you know, uh keep going so that you don't get dehydrated yourself. On those days we end up handling a lot of heat exhaustion cases. And in some cases we've had lifeguards heat exhaustion because they didn't hydrate properly. Yeah. And again, you know, they're kids, they were out might have been out drinking the night before, so it naturally dehydrates them. They come in and think they're gonna get through the day with it, and like I said, by three o'clock they're they're wiped, you know. You know, some we've got to tell them, you know, k go go down in that basement, get out of the sun, get some, you know, some fluids in you, get some, you know, electrolytes in you, you know, before you, you know, you we have to call the ambulance for you.

SPEAKER_04 28:43

What is something that made you consider quitting and why didn't you?

SPEAKER_00 28:48

Well, I I I really never considered quitting. You know, I mean family obligations came closer to that, you know. I mean, I I said, you know, when my kids were growing up, I coached football and I coached and not, you know, wrestling or swimming. So I spent a lot of time away from my family. So during the summer, again, a lot of my time was spent here. Fortunately, when my kids were young, it was, again, fortunate, unfortunately, when the city was kind of in the doldrums. It was when when they were in in their decline state. And um, I was able to bring my kids to the beach with me. So when when they were old enough, they could come and they could spend the day uh at the beach with me. So that that was that was really good because I said you know, uh I I I didn't want to miss my kids growing up. Yeah. And like I said, I I I I I taught and coached and everything. A lot of times, it wasn't for the money, but without that money, it would have made us a struggle for us. So I I coached, and again, I I enjoyed coaching the sports that I coached and everything, but like I said, it was a lot of time away from my family, especially coaching football. So I actually had to give up football at one time because of that. When we had our second child, um my wife had to spend, you know, she had to get the kids ready in the morning, drop them off the babysitter, pick them up, bring them home, get them ready, you know, because when I was coaching football, I was getting home at eight, nine o'clock at night. So she had the kids all day long, and it wasn't fair that, you know, that she she she's she had a full-time job also. Yeah. So that was the first thing that that I gave up to spend more time. But again, since I was able to be with my kids in the summertime, um, at the time we I had a sailboat, so many nights after work, we would just pick up pizza or Chinese food, and we'd go down to the boat and we'd eat dinner down at the dock and go crabbing and fishing. Oh, that's nice. So I got to spend a lot of time after hours with my kids too. On the bay? On the bay, yeah, back in Shark River there. Yeah, so that that that that kind of helped me get through this, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 30:38

Asbury Park is a really unique place that's you know, when people say the beach, you know, I listen to ocean sounds to go to sleep at night. I I love I I could stare at the ocean all day long. I didn't grow up going to the beach, but I love it. It's my favorite place is actually Asbury Park. Um and uh but some people have have different opinions about Asbury Park. They uh talk about it as a uh great place for the LGBT community. They may talk about it as a formerly dangerous place or as an investment opportunity. What is your what is your view of Asbury Park?

SPEAKER_00 31:12

Well, I I've seen it full cycle. When I first started here, Asbury was a place to be. You know, we we had ever every weekend was busy, people all summer long, the boardwalk. Um they had most FD Summer of Stars here. That summer, well, every summer he you know he had different groups and pretty much everybody except the Beatles played here. The Rolling Stones, Elton John, you name it. I saw Chicago Transit Authority when they were the warm-up group for the Eagles, you know. You know, so you know we we saw one of the perks of the job was the lifeguards ushered those shows. You got $10 cash and you could bring a date in. So we got to see all all those shows that were here. Like I said, you know, and and so, you know, the 60s that was when, you know, the you know the the music went, you know, r really became a a big thing, you know, they were in the 60s and 70s. And so I said we got to see the f and and they had every range of music. The first showings of Jesus Christ Superstar, it was kind of like their dress rehearsal. They did four shows here. And then they went to Broadway from here, they came over from from from England. So we got to see that and and um like I said all all the other big stars were here. Yeah, so you name it from the 60s, they they were here. So we got we got to see that. They had professional wrestling down here, you know. So we a lot of things were going on. And like I said, the place was mobbed all the time. Good restaurants, you know, a lot of stuff to do. And then in 1970, the the the race riots. Okay. Um and it was all over, it was all over the country that they were having it. But we they had them here, and um for a week was it was very bad. You know, and it was it happened on the west side of town, um, but it affected everything, you know. And after that it was a slow decline. And then in the 80s it was a click quicker decline. Okay in the 90s, between the nineties and and the and the early 2000s, i it it was there was nobody here. Yeah. There was one concession open on the boardwalk. That was it. Wow. And again, that's when people, you know, it got afraid to come down here because there, you know, there was there was you know, there were drugs and there was things going on like that. But you know, it there was really nothing to come here for other than the beach. Yeah. And there was nobody on the beach. So some people like that. They they said, I have, you know, it's my private beach. Yeah. And it was like $2 to get on the beach back then. Yeah. Season passed was $20, whatever it was. So some of the local people came here, was was you know a paradise for them. But other people wouldn't come here because they were afraid to come here. And and uh you you talked about the gay community, they kind of held the town together and went going through that. They moved into town. Um, there used to be a lot of rooming houses and older houses. They took those houses and they renovated them and and and and and brought a lot of them back, and they kept a lot of the businesses alive here in town. Okay. So it was really a s a save saving thing for the city. And and then it it it stayed that way. And in 2003, redevelopment came in, and we had a couple of big companies come through and um renovate the buildings and bring businesses into town, and for the last eight or nine years it's been like it was back in the 60s, early 60s, it's been the place to be. It's it's a it's a destination spot. We have the See Here Now concert here, 35,000 people on the beach here. It's it's people come from all over the world to go to that. I mean, I talk to people from all over the world that come, depending on who's there. Um, you know, people from Oregon and Wisconsin and Minnesota and Europe, you know, different places. And um years ago, you know, when when Springsteen was, you know, he you know he he was always uh you know a draw to the town. Yeah. We'd have busloads come over from Europe, uh do a Springsteen tour. They'd go to the Stone Pony and they'd stop around, take pictures in front of different places. You know, Bon Jovi, you know, he he earned his stripes here too. He played at the Fast Lane, which was a bowling alley, but it had a you know a bar in there too, and and and entertainment. Um like the Stone Pony was it originally was called Mrs. J's. And it was a big beer garden out there in the back where the summer stage is now, and it was a very popular place to go. And then, like I said, during the the bad years it it died off and it became what it is now, the Stone Pony.

SPEAKER_03 35:12

Wow. Yeah, that's it.

SPEAKER_00 35:13

So it's it's it's known all over. It's funny. Uh my my son's roommate in college was from Tennessee. And his father was a doctor. So they were very good to my son, you know, they were and and they got to be very good friends, and the family got to be very good friends. So he came up to visit one time and he wanted a sweatshirt from Asbury Park, and he went in the stores and he couldn't find anything he liked. So when he left, I went over and I got some Stone Pony sweatshirts, and we sent them to him. And his father says, I went there in like 1975. I w you know, he he went to the Stone Pony. He's from the Massachusetts area, but he came here and went to the Stone Pony, and he thought so he he he thought the shirt was was great because you know he's a Springsteen fan and everything, you know.

SPEAKER_04 35:54

Yeah, it's really a remarkable place. Like the Jersey Shores. It's always been that way.

SPEAKER_00 35:59

It's it's always been that way. It's it's it's like I said, we we it you know, things happen here that don't happen with like the Morrow Castle landed on a beach right there in front of convention hall. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You've probably seen pictures of that. Yeah. It's always been a very unique place. Like I said, you know, with between the music and and the stuff going on, and now the restaurants and bars and everything I said in. Cookman have it is wild. Yeah, yeah, it is every step is there. I mean, I I live in Walt Township, but probably three-quarters of the time my wife and I go out to eat, we come to Hasbury Park. Okay. There's a lot of good restaurants, and yeah. Our favorite restaurant is here, it's Taca. We like sushi down there. It's it's as good as you're gonna find any place in in New York or whatever. You know, it's great, it's great. We we've been going there since they opened up 25 years ago.

SPEAKER_04 36:46

All the people I've talked to on this show have referred to COVID as a very tough time, maybe a turning point in their career. They changed careers. And Joe's response to my question uh brought up some. Well, yeah, that year that year was difficult for us.

SPEAKER_00 37:01

The city um council and and and manager were they w they weren't gonna have uh people coming here and getting sick. So we limited the number of people on the beach. Okay. Uh we did some calculations and figured out if everybody took up 12 square feet, which is what they said you needed, how many people could we fit on this beach? Yeah. So we just did some rough estimates on it and we said, you know, X thousand number, that's it. So we knew how many season badges we sold. We kept track of how many came down in the course of a day on an average day, and then we subtracted that from from the that number that we had, and the rest were sold as daily passes. So we limited the number so that we had enough space on the beach for everyone to have their 12 feet. And um again, you know, we we were concerned with the lifeguards. We we had them, you know, we bought buffs for them to wear so that they they could, you know, cover their faces, and and you know, which turned out to be not necessary, but you know, we we we went through all the pro protocols and and and we limited it, which caused problems. You know, people drive two hours to come here and we said we're sold out for the day. Yeah, we we know so it w it was tough on us. And it did affect the revenue that we had, but like I said, the this this this this this city was wasn't concerned about the money. They were more concerned about the safety of the people coming here. They wanted people to come here and feel safe and be safe, so uh we we got through it that that way. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 38:23

I figured I knew the answer to this question, but I still wanted to ask. Do you go to the beach for a fine?

SPEAKER_00 38:29

I do. I do, yeah, yeah. Well again, when my kids were young, um that was my day off, wasn't it? The day at the beach with my kids. Yeah, yeah. I I said, uh I I I never get sick of it. You know, I'm I'm I'm here six days a week and I said, you know, in the summertime it's where I where I'd rather be. I I don't play golf. Yeah, I don't play tennis. It's a relaxing day at the beach, but I said a after lifeguarding for all these years, um I still watch the water. So when I'm there and and my wife yells at me all the time because when when I see something going on, I stand up and look and she says, It's not your job, you're not working you know.